It fell to Elgin City chairman Graham Tatters to call out Hearts chairwoman, Ann Budge:
“We go and put the two teams who are bottom of the league in charge of the reconstruction talks.
“I just feel all of this is being done just to find a way to stop teams going down.
“We’ve lost out on the chance of promotion but when the resolution was put out to end the season it was a no-brainer for us.
“I’ve got no problem with Neil Doncaster and the SPFL. They are doing what they can and have been fantastic at getting information to all the clubs. Someone had to make the decision – there was no point fannying about.”
Tatters moved on from not fannying about to the crux of football’s problem:
“People are scared to say it but we might not be playing until Christmas, or even until they have a vaccine.
“Forget about playing behind closed doors. We have a real problem here. Reconstruction talk is a bit of a joke – it’s a total red herring.”
It is impossible to decide how many teams should occupy each league on a temporary two-year basis (which Budge hopes will give her enough time to avoid relegation) if you do not know how many games it will be possible to play next season, what cash flow there will be in the game or how many professional clubs will remain in business.
If Motherwell and Kilmarnock cannot sell a match ticket until January, and then only for around a dozen home games, will they want the league’s commercial income distributed 14 ways instead of 12?
With so many clubs sitting precariously on the edge of insolvency, do you expect them to vote to reduce their share of the pie? I think Ann Budge will meet resistance in her plans to reconstruct Scottish football on a temporary basis to allow Hearts to avoid relegation.
Reconstruction is in the wind, but will look different to what many imagine. Pretty much all of the community clubs, occupying the bottom two leagues in the SPFL can cut their cash burn to near zero and survive, the same is true for some in the Championship, with Alloa and Arbroath.
The vast majority of the rest will have to go into administration, make relatively high-earners redundant, in order to survive. How else can Aberdeen get through a £1m per month cash burn? There will be a Bonfire of the Vanities, from Edinburgh, to Aberdeen, Dundee and, of course, Govan. The same is true across Europe, most particularly, in the English Championship.
There is an almighty reconstruction ahead, but I don’t think anyone can imagine what it will look like yet. Dare we hope for the biggest change of all? I’m not sure.
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Top two movies of all time
Godfather
Godfather II
Brent crude now below $20 a barrel.
Is the north sea oil industry kaput?
Highland spring bottled water is now more valuable than oil.
Speculation is rife, is there any other kind, that North Korean Leader Kim Jong Un is gravely ill following a heart procedure.
Which begs the question, where is the surgeon and why didn’t the Glorious Leader perform his own heart surgery?
I saw the highlights of Celtic beating Man U with the Naka free kick in 2006 on BT Sport.
Apart from the penalty save and a Saha chance which looked offside, Man U didn’t have any great opportunities.
That was a team with Van der Sar, Ferdinand, Scholes, Giggs, Ronaldo etc that went on to win the CL the next season.
The Celtic side was Boruc, Telfer, Balde, McManus, Naylor, Sno, Lennon, Gravesen, Naka, Zurawski, JVOH.
Subs that came on were Jarosik, Maloney and K Miller.
Obviously, we also pushed the winners AC Milan, that year close in the last 16.
An awful lot of ‘ordinary’ players in that Celtic side yet WGS doesn’t get the credit he should for how they performed in Europe.
Of the bigger names in that 14, Lenny was 35, Naka struggled a bit in the Euro matches, JVOH was a tryer and not much more at the top level, and Gravesen was starting to go loopy.
Boruc was immense at that time, though – pity he wasn’t there under MON.
A bit disappointing that we didn’t see the best of Jarosik at Celtic – he didn’t seem interested in the SPL but did alright in the CL.
what is the stars
Is that an ante-post bet?
Top 3 Hitchcock Movies
1. North by Northwest
2. Rear Window
3. Vertigo
Top 3 Horror movies of all time
1. Nosferatu
2. The Exorcist
3. The Shining
Top 3 Horror movies of all time
1. The Davie Dodds video
2. Rangers winning a league
3. Piers Morgan talking about anything
Just a wee thank you for all your favourite film, got to say did not expect that response. top 10 very difficult with so many great pics out there.
I mentioned Downfall with the late Bruno Ganz as Hitler, well worth the watch, great acting. Also worth a look is Crash, very clever and an Oscar winner, but as I say, thanks for the memories. Hmm ,did Bob Hope not sing that once.
Stay safe everyone and SOUTH OF TUNIS, let us know you are well and give your take on your top 10 films
KINGLuBO ( aka KingHell)
6 To 18 months for a vaccine,people should demand that these Pharmaceutical Company’s keep there greedy hands of BI tech company’s who probably will have a vaccine ready before 6 to 18 ,but these parasites who own these Pharmaceutical firms will be wanting top dollar or Pounds,This is people wee want to get well ,not your lifestyles you shower off evil B———s
Canman-SFTB
No way is my intellect anywhere close to some of the posts made this morning about the pandemic, but I will add my lone tuppence worth from the other point of view.
I wasn’t going to reply as it’s pointless cos we are so far apart with this issue, things will never be resolved, but I thought it was worth a try to explain masel and as a common courtesy, you believe the msm, I don’t, you are hanging your hat on the medical and other specialists who follow that party line come what may, I hang mine on people who have the balls to stand up against the establishment very often to the detriment of theirs careers and in some cases their lives, just ask Jullien Assange and countless others on that.
As for trying to say that a Psychiatrist is not worthy of speaking on the subject, when I went to school a shrink had to first become a doctor then go on to specialise in another field, but if you feel the need to attempt to ridicule them, fine, carry on, the world is full of people who have risen to their Peter Principal level, this pandemic sure is showing many up for what they really are.
So lets establish a line here, any figures that I may quote are taken from the experts that you rely on for you info, I won’t give you any figures that are not in the msm.
We are in what has been classed as a pandemic, in a pandemic people die, sometimes many people die so those in power have to decide what strategy they are going to embark on to save lives, imo the strategy that most governments have embarked on is wrong, so much so that, in the opinion of said experts, the experts that you believe, it will cause so much more problems down the line.
But as has been said we really don’t know what the right course of action will be. So all we can do is to speculate.
Lets take the herd immunity strategy, harsh for sure, the belief is that the strong will survive and that any second or consequent wave will be much less problematic, there is a lot to be said for this strategy, you both and many many others believe that this strategy is wrong and believe that confinement is the answer, because they say it will save lives, this for me poses many problems, and that’s without going into the civil rights, the freedom to assemble and free speech issues that every human has the right to.
The medical and professional experts that you believe in, have stated categorically that containment-imprisonment is severely detrimental to human health, be it on a mental and societal level, what is does to humans is already happening and it will cause many more problems further down the line, there has already been an exponential rise in stress related diseases, heart attacks and the like, alcohol problems, divorce, suicides, domestic abuse, [here in Spain since the lock down domestic abuse cases have risen by 18% so far] murders, serious assaults, child abuse, abortions, there are others but you get the picture.
Confinement will have to be repeated time and time again where the same problems will compound again and again, how many more, imo unnecessary deaths and other problems will this cause.
If as the experts, the experts you believe, are saying that Covid-19 is a derivative of SARS and MERS there will be no vaccine for it, as there is no vaccine for SARS and MERS, but people will keep looking for one and may just have one in the pipeline, why else would Bill Gates have obtained the patent for one last year from the European patent agency, patent number EP 3 172 319 B1.
You accuse me of not thinking about things through, trust me I have, I have come to the conclusion that given people are going to die, would it not be better to at least try to reduce the scale and alleviate any additional problems down the line, you think otherwise, fine I can live with that.
Maybes if people were to focus on the positive side of things instead of always the doom and gloom things, 99.63% that catch the virus survive, that to me seems way better than focusing on a death rate of 0.37%.
What is the Government slogan again, “Stay home-Save lives” that must be the biggest piece of utter hypocrisy I have ever heard in my life.
So in conclusion Canman, you reckon that for my stance you have misjudged me and my words ring hollow, again I can live with that as, imo it’s way better than what’s gonna be coming down the pipe with all the other additional problems that imprisonment is gonna cause, as long as you can live with that.
You can rest assured I won’t judge you for your stance.
HH
Q
Paul67 et al
Well, UEFA is meeting in some form this afternoon so it’s possible that we may get some idea of direction they would favour or support. They have already re-scheduled their own Euros to next summer, though whether the multiple country format will survive is another thing. That is a big earner for them, as is the CL and EL matches yet to be played this season. My guess is that they will favour any solution which favours UEFA and its’ tourneys. They have been making a balls-up of the CL in recent years, to the extent that when you play the second leg you can’t remember the result from the first one it was that long ago. The NFL showed them how to do things last season, unlike the CL it does not run from July through to June. Maybe time to reconstruct UEFA’s competitions, or better still deconstruct them.
No PPE?
No problem.
https://t.co/5dqxEfiXQs?amp=1
We’ll just gag our staff from highlighting the issue.
Yet some critice China for being Totalitarian, but blindly support a government who expect our front line workers to put their lives at risk with no PPE and keep quiet for the privilege.
TET
What’s your thoughts on whether tourists will be allowed back into Spain this year ?.
HH
Brilliant stuff Pablo. Respect.
This is the reality.
Sevco, their supporters and their placemen in the SMSM are living in a parallel universe.
It does one no good even dipping a toe periodically into this universe.
Let them yap, tweet, howl, snarl, statement, spin and self delude.
We don’t need to say (or hear) a thing.
Celtic have a coherent, flexible, sustainable, long term strategy – Paul called it last week, only the details will change.
Srategies are never sexy or seductive, they don’t win you the back page.
However the value of ours will become apparent when this is over.
Hail hail
Keep The Faith
Embra Mike!
From last article, thanks for the heads up on the alt version of that choon………
I’ll check it out. A classic amongst a classic film.
Cheers!
HH
Bada
Worry no more. The Judith is doing the weather forecast on radio Scotland in the mornings from her home.
The Judith will return.
ADI
From what I can see most hotels have decided that next Easter will be the soonest that they will be able to trade with any kinda certainty as things stand, so in answer to your question, I would very much doubt it.
We are on a severe lock down here, so I doubt the government here will allow people in from outside unless they are sure it will be safe to do so, but as things are changing daily so we will just have to wait see, there is talk of restrictions being lifted, the first one is next Monday kids will be allowed out to play, others like bars and restaurants are way off, there is also talk of certain areas being open before others, where I am hopefully will be first in the Q as we have had virtually no problems here.
HH
Paul67 et al
UEFA has spoken. I think.
Domestic leagues to restart in June.
CL Final August 29 Istanbul
ddddd
ADI
Just had a look and defo not, the government have said today that tourism, bars and restaurants are looking at December opening at the earliest.
HH
TET Spanish opening Spanish schedule
I probably got from a hospitality thing
Opening Dates:
May 12: Small business, dealers and workshops.
May 23: Parks and Gardens.
May 25: Personal services.
May 26: National population transit.
June 1: Cafes, restaurants and bars.
June 6: Study centers.
June 7: Hotels and tourist accommodation.
Followed by
There will be no travel from the UK till July
WDH
That is fake.
I heard the head of the Canaries today bitching at the government for lumping them in with all other regions, the islands are virtually virus free and they rely totally on tourism.
HH
TET
cheers
had sent it to friends here with family over there
will need to update
CELTIC MAC on 21ST APRIL 2020 3:47 PM
There will be no football until national governments allow it.
UEFA are responsible for increasing and accelerating the spread of the virus.
They should wind their necks in.
TET,
first off, the closest this to MSM I watch is RT and you’ll note RT is on the receiving end of MSM’s spite because in the words of an American senator during their investigation into the propaganda war, RT are making headway because “they tell the truth” that’s the words of an American senator.
I do not watch western media because I’ve learned to distrust anything it offers.
I should also advise I have been criticized on here recently because I continually post links to information clearing house and that all the articles from different sources posted on that site have been counted as a single source.
Next, as previously identified the figure 0.34% you post is for Germany it is not an accepted general estimate, I’d be interested to know your source and what the details of that article reveal.
Finally, the most recent report from Chinese research on RT is even more scary than previous information, have a look
https://www.rt.com/news/486425-covid-19-mutations-deadlier-strains/
I still believe it is a man made virus and the only country with previous for releasing bioweapons on populations is the good oil US of A on both Cuba and North Korea/China.
I’ve consistently stuck by this opinion since the first two countries to suffer were China and Iran, followed by Italy who are the only country in Europe to agree a deal with China’s Belt and Road initiative.
I also provided a link found on the information clearing house that discussed an Indian research project that published research for peer review, that showed four HIV receptors have been introduced into the SARS-cov-2 which causes covid-19. The research concludes that it is very unlikely it was a natural mutation.
That research was hammered by American and Israeli researched to the extent they had to withdraw the article, what I found most suspicious when looking at the site and criticism of the research was that the criticism made sweeping statements but very little if any detailed points that would help the researchers address any faults to make corrections.
So, while your away chasing what I consider to be squirrels, I’ve been bouncing around my own rabbit holes battering off every wall :)
Paul 67
How about this idea I’ve floated elsewhere. It requires more strategic and less parochial thinking, although for some Scottish clubs amalgamation is an unthinkable that might have to be considered. Different solutions for different levels but at the higher level…
UEFA announce The Long Spoon Champions League played in different cities across Europe every weekend for next season.
The top teams from each league are involved and dont play in their domestic competition if there is one.
The proceeds of the TLSCL where TV Companies sell access globally are paid out on a solidarity basis.
Players with no wage competition in their favour play for the equivalent of £25k a year or whatever is deemed to be the average working man wage across Europe. It’s that or no club to sue.
The big clubs recognise that they need smaller clubs for a host of reasons, player development, cannon fodder, keeping football and community aligned , so they play on a cost neutral base.
The proceeds after these costs get paid to national associations free to devise the spend to keep clubs turning over or mothballed until their national league starts.
Sponsors would queue up to be involved to add to TV income.
Logistics to be worked out including safety but easier to implement over say 40 clubs than 1000.
In short UEFA assume responsibility to lead the clubs through difficult times.
Unthinkable 3 months ago, but that was then, this is now for an unknown while.
spain at the moment very strict only one person is alloud to drive and go to shops so thats mrs chanty dont fancy left hand driving as barcelona are looking for someone to name the camp nou for a season is there a stadium in scotland named poundland sure i read it somewere hope the jambos go down the hate in swinecastle is a disgrace h h
Ernie @4:10
Absolutely correct, these buffoons think they can dictate when football begins, as delusional as a Hun😱
Auldheid,
That’s a pretty good idea but as usual greed will prevent it. To socialist in thinking :)
ernie lynch
Good point Ernie. Yet another self-serving organisation (see Graham Allison on that one) leading from the back. Think they are hoping playing behind closed doors might offer a solution. While the rest of us are hiding behind the curtains.
TET @ 3.16
A considered and detailed reply.
However, in replying to 2 or more posters, some cross-contamination of points is inevitable so let me clarify the points of mine which I think are misrepresented.
1) “you believe the msm, I don’t, you are hanging your hat on the medical and other specialists who follow that party line come what may, I hang mine on people who have the balls to stand up against the establishment very often to the detriment of theirs careers and in some cases their lives, just ask Jullien Assange and countless others on that.”
———————————————————
I believe the peer researched and critiqued medical information and have no interest in defending the MSM who are as varied a group of people as are internet Bams. There is a code of ethics behind medical research wherein you must cite the preceding research on which you build, outline your research methods and allow others to replicate your work either to corroborate it or critique it. Some research can be open to bias, unconscious or deliberate, so , again, protocols have built up whereby research papers list their funding resources. There are umpteen instances of promising results which could lead to money making drugs for “Big Pharma” being critiqued by peers, whose funding also comes from “Big Pharma”, and yet drug-debunking studies are prevalent. It s certainly not beyond criticism but Medical Ethics are taken seriously by most, Most research cheats get found out, whether its Cyril Burt on Intelligence testing or Andrew Wakefield on vaccines. And they get found out by their peers not their bosses or the professional elite.
Being a rebel against the “establishment” is not, per se, a virtuous position. Being sceptical of “established” truths is. You have to have an alternative explanation and an alternative truth-testing or hypothesis-testing approach in your method. It really is not compelling to say, It’s my alternative opinion- I can’t prove it and I won’t have it put to any test by others- just take it or leave it!” There is egotism involved in adopting some rebel poses. The trick is being able to discern who are good rebels and who are not. The DIxieland MAGA lot, despite belonging to relatively advantaged ethnic groups are dead keen to proclaim thesmelves as the people fighting some elite, and they tilt lances at the Elite while being led by Establishment figures like Farage, Bojo, Trump etc;
2) “As for trying to say that a Psychiatrist is not worthy of speaking on the subject, when I went to school a shrink had to first become a doctor then go on to specialise in another field, but if you feel the need to attempt to ridicule them, fine”.
————————————————
I know what Psychiatric training consists of and that’s what I critiqued, his lack of training in the medical fields pertinent to this study and his lack of any peer researched and critiqued articles on it. I did not and do not say he should not have a voice but his opinions should be treated with the same scepticism as an informed and educated person who has not done the hard work in the field. i.e. “You may be right but do the research, under strict research conditions and prove it!” Otherwise you are dealing with the same scenario as a pro footballer meeting a middle age fatso who tells him he was a better player then the pro but “my face didn’t fit”. It’s deeply unconvincing. I am willing to be a bit more scathing about Osteopaths, however but I will limit myself to the official NHS position:- “In the UK, osteopathy is a health profession regulated by UK law. Although osteopaths may use some conventional medical techniques, the use of osteopathy isn’t always based on scientific evidence.”
3) “The medical and professional experts that you believe in, have stated categorically that containment-imprisonment is severely detrimental to human health, be it on a mental and societal level, what is does to humans is already happening and it will cause many more problems further down the line, there has already been an exponential rise in stress related diseases, ”
—————————————————————-
The lockdown was not taken lightly- most governments wanted not to do it because of economic considerations, but were forced to do so by Medical Opinion. We always knew it would be difficult to enforce, regulate and maintain. People have actually shown a great deal of resilience and the long term effects are pretty much guesswork because we have no equivalent data with which to compare this period of time. There has been no exponential rise in stress conditions because no one is evaluating most mild to moderate stress conditions with any rigour or accuracy. What was reported was a rise in anxiety levels and self-reports of stress, depression and anxiety during the early days of lockdown, compared with the levels reported in the days before lockdown. Most of that stress and anxiety comes from the fear of the damage the virus may do, the fear that loved ones will die, rather than arising from boredom of having a few lazy days cooped up, with or without your kids and extended family. The evidence from the UK and most of Europe is of a population willing to endure the deprivations necessary to keep the deaths as low as we can keep them. Previous social research has shown, that, battleground trauma apart, most populations display great Mental Health resilience during periods of adversity.
Nonetheless, we will still need to alter some habits post-lockdown as it will not be, in any way, a return to what was before- certainly not quickly.
4) “Lets take the herd immunity strategy, harsh for sure, the belief is that the strong will survive and that any second or consequent wave will be much less problematic, there is a lot to be said for this strategy, you both and many many others believe that this strategy is wrong and believe that confinement is the answer,”
——————————————
Herd Immunity is more of a valuable side effect, if it works, than the actual strategy itself. In this country, it is not seperate but completely interlinked with the lockdown approach. Lockdown aimed to slow the growth and spread of this virus in the general population until we had developed the resources to be able to deal with those who had contracted the virus and had developed moderate to severe effects under it. It is the case that we spent months underestimating and failing to prepare our resources which means that not all of the deaths over the past 2 months have been inevitable. With better access to ventilators, PPE and oxygen equipment, we could have saved a proportion of those who have already died. However, once the seriousness had been lodged, there have been great efforts to slow the curve, keep the NHS operational, and ensure that our death rate has not been much greater than it has been. We have not been as effective as South Korea and Germany or even, Ireland but we have not been as bad as some other areas and we have yet to hear how Third World infrastructures cope with this disease.
I certainly don’t believe that lockdown followed by a post-lockdown testing of the Herd Immunity option is wrong but I am prepared to believe it might be. For me , it’s the same choice as Global Warming- Do we go on consuming scarce resources and expecting Science & Technology to develop something which does not, as yet exist, to provide us with cheap energy, or do we adjust our lifestyles to give science a fighting chance and some breathing space.
Going headlong into Herd Immunity strategy could see a lot more people die a lot more quickly with no clear indication that herd immunity will be built up any faster or more efficiently than without a lockdown. At the very least, we should see more doctors and nurses survive the First Wave to help us htrough the 2nd Wave, and we have no clear idea of how tough that second wave is gonna be.
My best prediction is that schools, concerts and large crowd sports are going to be unavailable through to , at least, August, and possibly much later. There will be a resumption of some economic activity- some small shops and stores reopening but with capacity and distancing restrictions. How long this last is wholly dependant upon the post-lockdown-relaxation rates of infection and death. There will be many more deaths- but, hopefully, with continued discipline and good sense, we will not be responsible for accelerating too many deaths by a reckless sense of immunity and invilability
THE EXILED TIM on 21ST APRIL 2020 3:46 PM
ADI
Thanks and take care
Excellent stuff from the Elgin chairman – Budge thinks she can make sh*te up to save her own f&^$ up! Now that’s a hun.
Ok lads. I’ll have a Danish.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52347927
On a more serious point I think it a mistake to underestimate human ingenuity when it comes to survival.
We have been at it for eons.
Auldheid,
eons-a period of one thousand million years, one billion years.
I’m no to sure about that.
Canamalar at al,
Very good, informative and considered debate.
I’m sceptical of all media outlets especially RT as outlined by the Guardian ( who I’m also sceptical about )
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jul/26/russia-disinformation-rt-nuanced-online-ofcom-fine
Cheers and HH.