The Scottish Government yesterday suggested the SFA act unilaterally to introduce Strict Liability on the game, making clubs liable for the actions of their lunatic fringe, or else the government would impose measures. This is a curious stance for a government who are not prepared to accept ANY liability for their own lunatic fringe.
When the lunatics in charge only see other people’s lunatics, we’re all in trouble. And it should be noted, lunatics inhibiting a democracy cause vastly more damage than football fans fighting on a field once every 36 years.
The notion of Strict Liability in itself is a separate question, but I have serious concerns at the increasingly right wing, and selective, attitude to law and control at Holyrood.
If you want to impose Strict Liability on football, accept if for yourself first. Then come back after a year’s experience and talk to us about football. This, of course, will never happen. Not all lunatic fringes are equal.
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TWISTS N TURNS on 3RD JUNE 2016 10:59 AM
Billy
I thought you’d be outside court today with a lot of rotten eggs?
Oh and something to throw at Green , Whyte and co :-)
…………………………………………………………………
Why would one do that to a hero?
Expected reply from the man with thee multitasking hand. :)
Hooked! Lined! & Sinkered!
:))))))
MWD
BEATBHOY
CAPTAIN BEEFHEART has his detractors on here,an easy job as he’s no loss to The Diplomatic Corps.
However,he has a point,which ties in with my earlier reply to ANTEARMANN.
Beefy is wrong about our songs being sectarian. On that,I agree with you.
However,some of our songs are “deemed” to be so,witness the arrests under OBaF for Roll of Honour,etc. That these were dealt with at the time as “offensive” will matter not a jot.
Strict liability will be enforced against us more than anyone else. Judicious placing of microphones,anyone?
CB is,IMO,pointing out that our level of offence may be lower,but it will be similarly punished.
Geordie
I saw the Championship table with the Divisional Title ( not League)winners sitting proudly at the top, but even going to the archive section, couldn’t get the Premiership.
As you say, weird!
My friends in Celtic,
I do not regard myself as paranoid, although I know someone is watching me.
But can you imagine the fall out and repercussions if we had been involved in the now infamous Scottish Cup Final. I really believe both clubs have had a relatively easy ride from the SFA and the governing authorities. Sevco because they are Sevco and Hibs because of Petrie.
Our club and our fans would have been hung, drawn and quartered by now. Our clubs leaders would have been dizzy attending all the governments summits.
Strict Liability would have been the joyful order of the day and vigorously pursued.
I had a quiet chuckle yesterday when I repeated heard Scotland been described as totally Orange by Sky News when discussing The EU referendum.
I couldn’t help but agree.
Hail, Hail.
TRADITIONALIST88 on 3RD JUNE 2016 11:12 AM
thomthethim for Oscar OK on 3rd June 2016 10:52 am
‘Be specific – list the sectarian songs that will see us deducted point after point.’
####
I think it’s more likely that points would be deducted for ‘offensive’ songs, banners, chants etc.
For which we should be grateful to everyone who voted SNP.
‘Stronger for Scotland’.
Craig whyte case adjoured till july 29th
Bobby M,
Morning. Quick reply. I didn’t say they were sectarian. Point was that we will be in trouble at some point.
BMCUW
Sure that’s meant for me?
My point was that the SPFL is already farcical due to its unstinting support for the same club/ continuity myth.
Hail Hail!
Craig Whyte leaves court as onlooker shouts “you’re a dead man.”
On Twitter …oh dear.
Trad88,
What I was saying, obviously not very clearly, is that if any form of strict liability comes in, any action from the Celtic support, which the hyper sensitive custodians of the game find offensive, will feel the full force of the law.
It doesn’t matter what you or I or anyone with our leanings think about it, it will happen,( ref.the OBAF Act).
As to the “fan trouble” mention.
Back in the 30’s, I can check back to be more precise, but, so can you, a disturbance in the Celtic End at Ibrox resulted in Celtic Park being closed for, I think, two months. Again the period can be checked.
I have no recollection of that happening at any other Scottish ground.
That is about specific as I can be.
Do you not think that the Celtic support would be a target, justified or not?
Why are they upset with Craig Whyte…..after all it was only the company that died ?????
TD67
Have a great break away from the madness
Say nice show to “Donnelly your weekend guy”
Under strict liability the Celtic support would be a massive target.
“They” will use any means possible to weaken us
If they were serious about cleaning up the game (fan wise)…they have had plenty of opportunities to do it in past, with the legislation that was available (even before the offensive at football act)
ernie lynch on 3rd June 2016 11:21 am
Are they stupid enough to go there…probably, I suppose.
There are a not insignificant number of people who take offensive by the colour green, and they’re not just in Larkhall.
HH
BOGNORBHOY
i urge will, I’m that the airport as we speak, sipping on a Peroni, all good :))
Urge=sure
Oaks today.
Warrants being favourite but given the uncertainty about it staying the extra 4 four furlongs I can’t have the favourite.
Prefer an each way on Diamonds pour moi . 16s and 20’s available.
tonydonnelly67 on 3rd June 2016 11:28 am
Craig Whyte leaves court as onlooker shouts “you’re a dead man.”
On Twitter …oh dear.
—–
Was it john Brown that shouted it?
UTLR… on 3RD JUNE 2016 11:36 AM
How do you deal with thousands doing BB at a game? It’s totally impractical to try and arrest and charge them all.
It’s for instances like this that I believe their should be some form of strict liability. Other than that deal with offensive individuals by themselves with no strict liability involvement.
Craig Whyte will return as The Craig Whyte.
The Scottish Government may try to impose strict liability, but who will enforce it? Right now, it’s up to the police to decide if some song or sentiment might cause offence at (or on the way to) a football game (or related football event). Apparently OBAF was introduce to “deal with” bad behaviour at football. Looking at the Scottish Cup Final, it seems not to have worked well?
Meanwhile, Police Scotland recently stopped a church from showing a film because it was a bit too Irish-y for their liking. Anyone who thinks strict liability will be applied fairly is off their head. Whatever the intention of the Scottish Government, these rules are applied in a way that reinforce the inherent bias and racism of the enforcers to meet targets intended to demonstrate that a problem has been fixed.
In the meantime, tin soldiers are allowed to parade around the streets every July banging their toy drums like demented toddlers in an attempt to intimidate people they have an inbred hatred of.
It’s ironic reading good news stories about Scotland’s great work in taking in recent immigrants. The country still hasn’t accepted the communities that moved here from Ireland in the 19th century. If the Scottish Government want to fix the problem, they need to admit to having a problem first – Scotland is a racist and sectarian backwater. But I guess that doesn’t quite fit with their narrative. Football is being used as a convenient dodge.
thomthethim for Oscar OK on 3rd June 2016 11:31 am
If Celtic were to suffer a financial penalty and/or loss of points for songs you can buy in practically any music outlet it won’t take long to tear that argument to shreds.
We are not going to be deducted point after point. The huns might – and that is what I was replying to, us being placed in the same category as fans who sing about being up to their knees etc.
I don;t think incidents in the 30s carry much weight any longer, the event which carried weight was the 1980 cup final and it still affects the decision making process for applications received from clubs for alcohol licensing/standing areas etc. But as with the safe standing issue, evidence wins out in the end.
HH
*who are offended by the colour green
So the cost of tackling sectarianism in Scottish football is some collateral damage to our club due to Irish republicanism.
Is it a price worth paying?
Our club could stand behind the fans and fight to change public perception of what Irish republicanism is.
Or
Our club could ask the fans to desist from singing anything other than officially sanctioned Celtic songs.
Would our club have the balls for the fight?
cv
thetimreaper on 3rd June 2016 11:42 am
tonydonnelly67 on 3rd June 2016 11:28 am
Craig Whyte leaves court as onlooker shouts “you’re a dead man.”
On Twitter …oh dear.
—–
Was it john Brown that shouted it?
====================================
It was Bumme rBroon.
But he was misheard- actually shouted ‘Whurs ra deeds, man?!’
TRADITIONALIST88
Honestly pal, they’d use it like every other means: police, media, courts et-al to attack the Celtic.
If I’ve learnt nothing else in 40 years, it’s that no skewed view to attack Celtic is beyond them
TRADITIONALIST88 on 3RD JUNE 2016 11:49 AM
thomthethim for Oscar OK on 3rd June 2016 11:31 am
If Celtic were to suffer a financial penalty and/or loss of points for songs you can buy in practically any music outlet it won’t take long to tear that argument to shreds.
*******
The “argument” has already been torn to shreds, but the OBAF Act still applies, it still prosecutes those who sing the songs.
The relevance of the 30’s ground closure is that it applied “strict liability” to Celtic.
Hadn’t been done before or since.
Sevco are toxic. The statement issued by them after the Cup Final was a disaster for Scottish football.
“It must also be said that it was not at all helpful to see leading members of the Scottish Government, including the First Minister whose parish is Govan, passing comment on social media without any attempt to condemn the behaviour of Hibernian’s fans. These failures are unbecoming of our elected representatives.”
By either being intimidated to by them, supportive of them, eager for the bigot £, their toxicity, will haunt Scottish football.
Meanwhile, England, Wales even the 6 counties are on their way to the Euros while the news in Scotland is dictated by all things Sevco.
new article posted.
TONYDONNELLY67
if you meet up with EUGENE with the ponytail tell him his pal from BALORNOCK says hello.
Weeminger
Polis could easily note 10 seat numbers from each game where BB was sung and deal with them the week after.
Few weeks of this and word would get out that it wasn’t on and there would be consequences for those involved.
I just feel that the slightest wee thing and we would be hammered.
Look at St johnstone in Europe…15,000 fine for someone with a Palestinian flag ffs.
TONYDONNELLY67 on 3RD JUNE 2016 11:28 AM
Craig Whyte leaves court as onlooker shouts “you’re a dead man.”
On Twitter …oh dear.
That’s not a problem….he can be resurrected as MR. Craig Whyte…..
…or THE Craig Whyte ….hahahahahahaha….!!!!
Is Guardian advert still going ahead ?
‘m so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark’
RIP Ali