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For the sake of Celtic, time to look each other in the eye

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Yesterday’s statement by Celtic was clear and unambiguous.  The club are aware of reports of ill-treatment of supporters by police and have an established process in place to handle concerns, directed through the umbrella Fans Against Criminalisation Group (incorporating Association, GB, Affiliation, Irish Association and Trust).  Two complaints have been received and actioned since December, which sounds like we have an under-reporting issue.

I am very pleased they have committed to form a Complaints Panel, with representatives from the support and the club.  We are the one family so there is no need for the club to manage complaints, the support is more than qualified on this matter.  This is important as it gives supporters oversight and ensures the club cannot act behind supporters’ backs on such an important issue, which should ensure that going forward matters are dealt with properly.

This is the response I wanted from Celtic.

Celtic also suggest accusations they have targeted supporters are “without foundation”, asking “What would be the Club’s motivation for being involved in activity which targets or victimises supporters? It is simply not true. It does not make sense.”  It makes no sense, of course.

Statements from the Green Brigade on Saturday, and the Affiliation committee (who believe they were referred to in the Green Brigade’s statement) today, raise some real concerns.

If, as the Affiliation suggest, “In recent weeks have seen finger pointing, whispers, rumours and lies aimed at organisations and individuals within them from sections of our own support”, we have a poison in our midst.

These matters are important enough (to me, anyway) for all parties to require clarification.  Get whoever said what to whom about whoever in a room together.  You will soon find out who has the cojones to look everyone else in the eye, and you will find out who is damaging your football club.

Lest we forget, these matters are a result of First Fantasist Alex Salmond’s Offensive Behaviour at Football’ Bill.  The consequences of which were predicted by Fans Against Criminalisation Group, as well as Celtic, who in their written submission to the Justice Committee (sic) said as much:

“The legislation potentially discriminates against the football supporter by reason of that person being a football supporter. It criminalises him or her for being a football supporter and not only because of the nature of his or her behaviour. In other words, exactly the same behaviour could be deemed illegal if performed by a football supporter, while not constituting an offence by anyone not participating in a football environment.

“An offence of “offensive behaviour“ and the test of the reasonable person, are introduced in section 1(2) (e). This test is extremely wide and creates considerable uncertainty over what is or is not acceptable.

“If this offence is to be introduced notwithstanding our comments above, clear guidelines should be published by the Lord Advocate to explain what sorts of conduct are considered as offensive or unacceptable. The potential for confusion in the absence of clear and consistent guidelines is potentially limitless and runs the risk of the law becoming unenforceable, or brought into disrepute.”

The Scottish Government passed sloppy legislation and put extraordinary funds into a policing project which only serves to make them look clueless.
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  1. twists n turns

     

     

    12:05 on 19 February, 2013

     

     

    ‘I have noticed the post frequency slowing dramatically around now. I can only assume it is podium chase hour. Right? All sitting there with your message typed, copy, and refreshing frantically to get ready and hit paste? I’m right, I know I am. Paul 67, no new threads yet. I’m not ready.’

     

     

     

     

    Spooky or what?

  2. The Scottish Government passed sloppy legislation and put extraordinary funds into a policing project which only serves to make them look clueless.

     

     

    Let’s all remember that when they’re asking for more powers next year. (thumbsup)

  3. First tentative fumble for the ejection seat handle ;-)

     

     

     

    Rangers chief Charles Green wants Malcolm Murray out, it has been reported. Picture: Phil Wilkinson

     

     

    Published on Tuesday 19 February 2013 10:43

     

     

     

    RANGERS chief Charles Green has demanded that club chairman Malcolm Murray be removed from his post – or he’ll walk away from the club.

     

     

     

    THE bombshell was delivered at the first meeting of the new Ibrox board. Green appointed Murray in the summer to help him win over Rangers supporters, but has said that he feels he can no longer work with Murray.

     

     

     

    It is believed that Murray’s television appearance to discuss the club’s administration was the last straw for the chief executive, with sources claiming there is little chance of the relationship being rescued.

     

     

     

    There are reports of a long-running row between the duo, which directors at the club are concerned could scare away investors. The pair were ordered to attend peace talks in London in an effort to reassure those who had pumped money into the club of their ability to work together.

     

     

     

    Murray, a lifelong Rangers fan, is believed to have played a key role in building Rangers’ reputation among investors. The club brought in over £20million in a stock market flotation at the end of last year

  4. ‘Yesterday’s statement by Celtic was clear and unambiguous.’

     

     

     

    Did Celtic impose one match bans on anyone?

  5. BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS on

    ERNIE,TWISTS.

     

     

    I believe PAUL67 was waiting for the bell to go,to give HAMILTONTIM a chance to beat PHILVIS to the punch.

     

     

    To no avail-the master is back,and we are not worthy.

     

     

    Accordingly,I’m off to the pub!

  6. ernie

     

    I was a contender believe me, until some idiot came into the office looking for help on an important work matter just at the wrong moment. Unbelievable. Philvis was there for the taking, and I would have taken him but for outside interference.

  7. Is it just me, or does the uber trendy buzz phrase ‘going forward’ get right on your messerschmitt’s.

     

     

    No offence Paul.

  8. Disagree Paul.

     

     

    Celtic statements had little substance.

     

     

    Where there meetings held in December by officials of our club were a 30 min DVD taken from CCTV footage was shown and the phrase “Give them enough rope to hang themselves with” used in relation to pulling normal checks in Dundee.

     

     

    Were Celtic responsible for putting in place 1 match suspensions on individuals without firstly informing said individuals of their ban and reason for their ban.

     

     

    Two very important allegations that the club need to answer!

     

     

    MWD

  9. The people who foisted this garbage legislation should get the answer where it REALLY matters to them.

     

     

    At the ballot box.

     

     

    They know no other language.

  10. philvisreturns

     

     

    12:39 on 19 February, 2013

     

     

    ‘ernie lynch – Winners don’t use podium-enhancing substances. (thumbsup)’

     

     

     

     

    There will come a day when you will be on Oprah’s sofa, confessing all.

     

     

    Mark my words.

  11. Celtic First .

     

     

    The Prague Cemetery.

     

     

    I liked it . That Simonini is one real bad guy . Book encouraged me to do some digging —–I found this ——-

     

     

    Dialogue in Hell between Machievelli and Montesquieu [ Maurice Joly ] —- fabulous badness !

  12. So why is there an under-reporting issue? Clearly there have been more than two incidents – will fans have more confidence in the new Complaints Panel?

     

     

    I am very much in favour of dealing with our issues in house – give the media nothing to beat us with.

  13. On 15th/16th of March 100 cyclist will set off from 5 locations in the UK & Ireland for Belfast to raise funds that will go towards helping Wee Oscar Knox (check out the wee man himself – http://youtu.be/oVyxi7ypT4Y) fund the Immunotherapy treatment he so desperately requires. We will be leaving from:

     

     

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    We will be supported by 16 support team members over the 2 days also.

     

     

    Our team is made up of CQN’ers, KDS’ers, friends and family members and non Celtic supporters.

     

     

     

     

    You can support our cyclists and support team by making a donation to this event by clicking here (remember to leave your blog name for us to thank you):

     

     

    Wee Oscar 4 Life Cycle’s To Belfast March 2013

     

     

    or by texting BELF88 to 70070 followed by amount (between £1 to £10) you wish to donate:

     

     

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    We would like to thank Burns Interior Design, Morrisons Facilities Services – FM Division, Gardiner & Theobald Surveyors, ProAir Conditioning, Firewater, DAMM Environmental, Access, AJ Print, Oracle, Project Pipework & Piling, Business Continuity Services and Sublime Designs for their sponsorship of the WeeOscar4Life cycle’s to Belfast. If your company would like to sponsor this event please drop an email to weeoscar4life@gmail.com

     

     

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  14. Personally, I hope Murray stays as the Huns ceremonial grand moose.

     

     

    ————–

     

     

    Rangers hopes of reprieve in SPL vote sunk by ‘arrogant’ Malcolm Murray

     

    A presentation by the Rangers chairman, Malcolm Murray – described as “a disgrace” by one of those present – sank the last hopes of the newco club making a return to the Scottish Premier League at Hampden Park on Wednesday.

     

     

    Own goal: one SPL chairman said of Malcolm Murray: “The arrogance was unbelievable. The atmosphere hardened immediately. Charles Green conducted himself well enough but the Rangers chairman was arrogant and dogmatic.”

     

     

     Photo: REUTERS

     

    By Roddy Forsyth11:00PM BST 04 Jul 2012111 Comments

     

     

    The expectation beforehand within the SPL – shared by the Scottish Football Association – was that the outcome would be another deferral, leaving it to the Scottish Football League clubs to accept Rangers into their ranks and sparing the top division chairmen from a decision they did not want to make.

     

    There were also some who hoped that Rangers would be able to make sufficient case – coupled with a clear and evident change of attitude – for their admission to the SPL.

     

    However – and not for the first time in this saga – Rangers utterly misread the mood of the other SPL clubs. The faux pas occurred despite the fact that Rangers had been briefed at a meeting on Sunday attended by two other SPL chairmen and a vice-chairman, who stressed the need for humility.

     

    Murray, in blazer and club tie, arrived at the gathering on Wednesday with the frontman for the Sevco consortium, Charles Green – who did not sport the club’s uniform – and Ally McCoist, the Ibrox manager. A presentation brochure was distributed to the delegates.

     

    The back page featured a photograph of a Rangers title win with the words “We Are Rangers” emblazoned across the back page.

     

     

    “The arrogance was unbelievable,” said one chairman. “The atmosphere hardened immediately. Charles Green conducted himself well enough but the Rangers chairman was arrogant and dogmatic.”

     

    Another who was present told The Daily Telegraph: “Some people in the room wanted a reason to make a case for Rangers but the standard of the presentation was woeful.

     

    “Ally and Charles Green were not always on the same page but that was not damaging. The chairman was another matter entirely and the brochure was substandard – you could have easily knocked something better together given half an hour. It makes you wonder what kind of management team they have.”

     

    Murray, Green and McCoist absented themselves from the meeting to allow discussion, then returned for the vote and cast theirs as a proxy for Duff & Phelps, administrators of the Rangers oldco.

     

    Only Michael Johnston of Kilmarnock gave them any sort of support with an abstention, while the other 10 clubs – including those who had expressed a degree of willingness to help Rangers, voted ‘No’ to the newco’s admission.

     

    The Rangers party departed and a further two-hour discussion ensued. “It was constructive,” said one who took part. “People actually listened to one another and respected the other positions. It was a huge leap of faith for integrity and it’s now up to the SFA and SFL to make their decision.”

     

    Neil Doncaster, the SPL chief executive, said of the decision to refuse the newco entry: “Clearly there were discussions going on between the newco and the members and ultimately that could have led to a presentation and a proposal put to clubs that they might have said yes to.

     

    “In the end the proposal put forward to the clubs was considered and they said no.”

     

    He added: “I think [the vote] surprised a number of people. Money is important in professional football and I think what our chairmen have done today is put aside the short-term commercial considerations, that would ordinarily drive behaviour, ahead of the longer-term interests of their clubs – and supporter involvement has clearly been a huge part of that.

     

    “Ultimately they believe they have made the right decision and one that brings a bit more clarity to an unclear world. Until we know where Rangers are playing next year we won’t be able to ascertain what the damage is to the Scottish game.

     

    “A number of people have said the decision today has enhanced the reputation of the league but it’s not for me to say.”

     

    Celtic released a statement in which they expressed the integrity of Scottish football as the main reason behind their opposition of newco Rangers entering the SPL.

     

    It read: “Today’s decision to refuse access into the SPL was an overwhelming one and demonstrates the depth of feeling amongst everyone involved in Scottish football.

     

    “Fundamentally, the Celtic Board has also been very mindful of the need to take what it believes to be the correct course of action in protecting the integrity of the game in Scotland.

     

    “Throughout the whole sequence of events leading up to today’s decision the Celtic Board has been of the singular view that the integrity of the game in Scotland is of paramount importance.”

     

    The Rangers Supporters’ Trust, meanwhile, accused other SPL clubs of acting out of “malice”.

     

    Mark Dingwall, as spokesman for the Trust, said: “We are disappointed but not surprised by this decision which has been taken out of malice rather than for the greater good of the game”

  15. Paul67

     

     

    Good article and couldn’t agree more, the problem as widely predicted, is the OBFB with which Celtic and every football club has to deal with. If the GB can’t negotiate their way around the Bill, then blaming Celtic is wrong, and they will allieniate themselves. However, Celtic need to embrace this group, to the maximum possible extent as Saturday proved they were the opposite of what they are sometimes accused of, and showed remarkable restraint in the face of Police provocation.

  16. The Honest Mistake loves being first on

    Paul67,

     

    Re poison in our midst,

     

    It wouldn’t surprise me. The self policing of our support is lacking when it comes to weeding out lies against the club.

     

    Even on this site there are compulsive liars who continue to attack the club. It’s only a matter time before one of these causes a rift.

     

    Such gems over the years on this blog have included Lenny knocking up an intern, Lenny being a n alkie

  17. Time for the Celtic Family to unite, We are doing ourselves a grave disservice!

     

    We are going so well at the moment!

     

    No need to shoot ourselves, plenty of others only too willing to do that for us!

     

    H.H.

  18. saltires en sevilla on

    Paul67

     

     

    Great lead- get everyone around a table with all the issues on the table and sort this out -pronto!

     

     

    The GB have made a massive improvement to the atmosphere at CP, and they have the actual or tacit support of the vast majority of people who go to games. It’s good to see a statement offering some data/numbers on those affected by adverse police activity. However, they have not gone far enough in sharing the actual scale of the problem, and that may damage their case.

     

     

    Unless there is more information available that I have missed, they are declaring:

     

     

    * 10 members have been ‘lost’ ( left the GB group or banned from games?)

     

    * 3 members have been charged recently (not sure if they are included in the ten above?)

     

    * Arbitrary ‘one game bans’ at turnstiles for some ( presume DU game, but how many?)

     

    * ‘Numerous’ have been hassled at games and at work, home, airports-( not sure how many- why not share the number guys ?)

     

     

    Unfortunately, these figures are not significant enough to cause the full mobilisation of the Celtic family in support of injustices against the GB.

     

    The GB could choose to report more accurately on number of incidents and they should have all the details of members impacted. What is to be gained by not declaring the size of the problem? There is a risk that they will inadvertently create division within our support at a time when we should be more united than ever before. I don’t feel that is the intention, but there are some who enjoy the atmosphere created, but are not happy about all the other attendant ‘froth/noize’.

     

     

    The CFC statement has repeated an earlier request for GB/anyone, to raise complaints in a structured way. I don’t understand why the number of complaints thro’ the formal system does not reflect the declared GB incidents. I accept that people tend not to appeal for help from those who are abusing them. ( as someone here has already pointed out).

     

    However, it is important to get the cases registered on whatever complaint system is available, and use that as basis for building a solid collective case -either against the police and/or, as some claim, against the club.

     

     

    It is unhelpful in the extreme to make general complaints and moans about cases in an unstructured way on blogs or phone-ins. By all mean complain that way if it helps get it off the chest – but, firstly register your complaint, with all relevant details, in the formal channels. Keep a collective record and utilise legal support in a concerted effort to realise justice and gain improvement/reduction in adverse treatment. There is no real mileage in releasing a statement that fails to clarify actual numbers involved, it leads to suspicion

     

    ( I can hear Devil’s Advocate arguments already, for example: “is 10 not a rather nice round number?”)

     

     

    Large organisations make value/ judgment decisions based on outcomes of their formal complaints procedures. They can and do make changes when confronted with hard fact and evidence – On the other hand, when complaints or sense of injustice is simply seen as ‘noize’ or ‘froth’, the perpetrators simply point to the lack of formal data and declare ‘nothing to see here’ or ‘bampots’ . They move to the next item (last) on the Agenda – usually the Christmas Dance!

     

     

    GB can help their case by playing them at their own game – record in detail all complaints, follow the formal complaints processes to the absolute final stages -escalate and tie them up in knots with evidence and appeals. This will have the effect of toning down the worst of the harassment and perhaps stopping it all together (yes, I know).

     

     

    I have lost count of the times good people, with solid, valid grievances & complaints have been ignored, or worse, because they failed to register complaints at the earliest opportunity. The bullies get ‘off’ and that is as irritating as hell!!

     

     

    Clearly there is an issue to be addressed, and I hope it can be resolved ASAP

     

     

    We need the GB back to doing what they do best – in full flow- with the rest of the support responding in a positive way.

     

     

    HH

  19. The Honest Mistake loves being first on

    Cont….

     

    Lenny battering commons, bobo baldie writing a book, lawwell pocketing season book cash etc.

     

    Maybe the liars should be exposed.

  20. BOBBY MURDOCH’S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS – Roger Delgado was a childhood role model of mine. (thumbsup)

     

     

    twists n turns – You have a lovely office by the way. (thumbsup)

     

     

    TwoMacaroons – Is it just me, or does the uber trendy buzz phrase ‘going forward’ get right on your messerschmitt’s.

     

     

    I’m going to go ahead and speak to that. New articles represent inflection points on CQN, with podia being the low hanging fruit that proactive individuals with the appropriate bandwidth can be incentivised to co-opt. It’s all about synergies, do you see? (thumbsup)

  21. MWD@12:42

     

     

    Well said. Those 2 points have to be addressed by the club first before we can move forward.

     

     

    Failure to do so will confirm to many that the statement issued yesterday is a crock of horse manure.

  22. ‘Yesterday’s statement by Celtic was clear and unambiguous.’

     

     

    I would say the opposite. It didn’t answer any of the specifics highlighted in GB statement.

     

     

    Who banned supporters for one match? Can anyone other that the club do this?

     

    The agreement to meet then never be available?

     

    The offer of legal assistance?

     

    The Celtic security staff member testifying against Celtic supporters?

     

     

    Not taking sides, but one group has highlighted a lot of (perceived) issues with the other, but the other hasn’t answered any of them. Just a bland corporate piece of spin to try to pacify the masses.

     

     

    Someone is telling porkies, Celtic or the GB, and I think the supporters in general are entitled to know who.

  23. Alasdair MacLean,

     

     

    I can see real synergies between the paradigm you propose and the type of pro-active strategies we require to reach out to our fan base. Perhaps we could leverage some beneficial impact by diversifying through moving froward towards a more organic growth?

  24. The great and the good .

     

     

    Silvio Berlusconi takes time out from feeding Vote Me populism to the public to opine that AC Milan need to man mark Messi and play 2 up front..

     

     

    In other Berlusconi news — yesterday’s Vote Me – Only I can save Italy speech and rally was badly disrupted by a serious heckler -as the heckler was huckled out , Berlusconi turned on the reptilian smile and said —–” Nothing to worry about —- he’s obviously a Juve supporter “

  25. ArranmoreBhoyLXV11 on

    HH

     

     

    Winding up order? Join the queue Henriks Sombrero. Comical is it not? Did they ever pay compensation for taking Smith away from the Scotland job? Just a thought..

     

     

    Another six tonight Celtic please. Though 1-0 will suffice..

     

     

     

    HH