So much happened yesterday, I’ll be as brief as possible:
Newco Rangers sent their counsel to the Court of Session to protest Charles Green’s contract with the club, stating it should pay legal expenses, now crystallising ahead of his forthcoming criminal trial.
In opposing Green, James Wolffe QC raised various objections, but as is often the case when people speak on behalf of Newco, included an arbitrary insistence that Newco operated the same club as the now liquidated Rangers.
Green’s QC, Jonathan Brown, put his pit boots on before stating his client’s case, but tantalisingly, before lunch informed the court that he would return to the same club/new club debate later. And didn’t he. Brown explained that Sevco Scotland purchased the assets of Rangers, not the club itself, with poetic prose adding:
“The team are paid by Sevco, plat at a ground owned by Secvo, are trained by a manager who is employed by Sevco and fans buy tickets from Sevco. That is the business that is being carried on.”
Adding that Rangers were “a collection of assets”, “What if the players were sold to one person and Ibrox to antoher, where is the ‘club’ then?”
I had to look away from court reporter, James Dolman’s Twitter feed at this point. It was like watching an acquaintance being humiliated. Not something you want to see.
Lord Doherty will determine if Newco should pay Green’s costs in due course, but this will be soon, as Jonathan Brown noted, “the rainy day has arrived”.
This next bit is really important:
Soon after court ended, Dave King was out with a rambling statement on the Newco website. If it was designed to play to the galleries, it hit the spot. If it was designed to influence what happens to his club, or how others will regard his input, it was surely an horrendous mistake.
It was a hard day to be chairman of Rangers International FC PLC. The court hearing only happened because the club objected to its contract with Green, so the unedifying episode could easily have been avoided. Despite this, sometimes you have to shut your mouth.
Sure, some Newco fans love a bit of grandstanding, but you know what yesterday’s statement will achieve. If the objective of the statement was to convince other Scottish clubs not to consider disciplinary action against Sir David Murray, or oldco Rangers, for their actions, it was an almighty miscalculation.
Threats seldom work. This one is unlikely to curry favour: “If the history of our Club comes under attack we will deal with it in the strongest manner possible and will hold to account those persons who have acted against their fiduciary responsibilities to their own clubs and to Scottish football.”
In short:
Don’t threaten clubs you are trying to influence.
Don’t grandstand to your own fans if you are trying to influence other clubs.
Keep a poker face. Keep your mouth shut, even if it means taking grief from your fans for the lack of public reaction.
King’s statement also addressed the sporting advantage issue from what we now know was an unlawfully operated tax scheme. While the EBT scheme saved tens of millions of pounds, and King earlier intimated this did provide a sporting advantage, yesterday he insisted the advantage was financial, that the shareholders were “committed to providing funding to the club” and would have done so, if required.
Here’s the thing, in 2012 another King statement revealed, “I have made a claim of £20m on the basis of non-disclosure by the then chairman, David Murray, of Rangers true financial position as far back as 2000.”
That commitment to further shareholder funding seems predicated on some controversial information. According to King, of course. Controversial enough to launch a £20m claim, but not to inhibit investment.
For the war-chest hunters among you, if you read this article covering King’s 2012 statement, you’ll find a strong clue.
One other quick but important point:
Some media are attempting to portray questions of sporting advantage as Rangers being punished for spending money they could afford, a travesty, as so many other clubs have done likewise.
This must surely be a deliberate attempt to misunderstand the issue and manipulate the debate.
No one suggests Rangers should be punished for spending money they could not afford. The questions are straightforward:
Did Rangers break tax law, break SFA rules and break SPL rules, when contracting football players?
Did they disclose matters openly with authorities (in other words, inadvertently make mistakes), or did they conspire to subvert the rules by hiding incriminating information?
Spending like the Borgias? Time to move on. Conspiracy to subvert the rules? We have a problem.
Don’t be distracted by potential ramifications to these questions, they are irrelevant for now. We should consider no more than did they break all of the above rules, should any the rule breaking be interpreted as an oversight, or does evidence of conspiracy to subvert the rules exist?
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CANAMALAR
The people who deal in arms are sufficiently minted that they only use banks as an expediency. They don’t need to,as they can fund the deals themselves.
A better idea might be to shoot them. Pour encourager les autres not to do the same.
I’m in a Napoleon mood today,but I’m serious too. There’s no point in the handwringing in this part of the world while we turn a blind eye to supply.
Equally there is a lot of consideration to be given on how to defeat a guerilla enemy who don’t fear death. And in fact lust after it as their ultimate achievement in life.
The problem is that these people and their ideology are not going to go away. And that we in the west clearly haven’t got a clue about how to deal with them.
What did BFDJ say on Friday night? I only heard the backtracking. Do you know something this long slow death is too good for them.
Beef Chow Mein
Bit early for moonhowlin’, but thanks.
Roll ‘n skwerr suddenly not as appetising!
ALIGHTINSANITY
Don’t think of it as a long lingering death,look on it as death by a thousand cuts.
Every one of them hurts. None is fatal by itself. Cumulatively it comes to more than shouting ouch a thousand times.
And if that fails,think of Monty Python and The Black Knight.
Thought I would click on some of the adverts at the top of the blog, I can see the CQN corner changing dramatically…
Auldheid, will walk up with a pinstripe suit on and brolly in a Gene Kelly manner with two gorgeous girls on his arms.
Doc and Jobo with a full head of hair down to their waist with a couple of blondes on their arms.
Tony Donnelly, will appear in a Crombie with a red silk handkerchief in the top pocket and a pair of Doc martins with yellow laces ready for all comers.
Me, I reckon those adverts are a con :)
SIPSINI
You been sampling a couple of DD Specials,double-packed?
BMCUWP,
The banks who provide loans for the purchase of arms. To pay for treatment for victims.
Compensation from the arms dealers for civilian casualties
Melbourne Mick
If it’s not too late… (3-2-4-1)
Foster
McGrain McNeil Gemmel
Murdoch Hay
Johnstone Dalgleish Auld Lennox
Larsson
Yours in Celtic,
TB&F.
Oops, forgot the Subs…
Connolly, McStay, Sutton.
BMCUW hope hell is extra hot too. Should be with burning the carcass of the 2012 originals.
Melbourne Mick
Boruc
McGrain McNeill Elliot Gemmel
Jinky Murdoch McStay Auld
Sutton Larsson
Subs McBride Nicholas Van Dijk
(Gemmel of course is reserve Goalkeeper! :-)
CANAMALAR
The point I was making is that the dealers don’t need outside funding.
Think back to the first arms dealer I had ever heard of,Adnan Khassogi. In the 80s,he was worth about £20bn.
There are people like him worth considerably more now.
They don’t need banks. They have enough money to buy banks.
And quite possibly have done.
ALIGHTINSANITY
You are too nice a person,mate.
I hope it is nice and cold.
Which facilitates the dish of revenge.
BMCUWP,
I know the point you were making, you seem to have got lost on the points I was making.
Fine arms dealers to pay compensation to the victims of their produce.
Fine banks who lend to the buyers of arms to pay for the treatment of victims
If we are getting multiple choices at the old Aussie Celtic select, and given the hints about some iconic 80s Celts I’ll try
Bonner
McGrain McNeill Gemmell Rogan
Murdoch McStay Burns
Johnstone Dalglish Larsson
Subs Lennox, Doyle, Moravcik
Just listened to a really good interview on Radio Scotland, wheelchair tennis champion Gorodn Reid, Scottish guy paralysed at the age of 12, inspirational stuff….. At one point he refers to his paralysis as when I used to be able to stand up, not that he needs it but hope he goes onto even greater things
From Dan O’Brien in today’s Irish Sunday Independent
Finally, a word on the “what about” brigade. As always happens when attacks of this kind take place, there are those who say that a particular country, or the West in general, is reaping what it has sown. If this post-colonial border hadn’t been drawn in such a way or if that military intervention hadn’t happened, all would be well in the world the what-abouters imply. Peace would reign. Everyone would live in harmony and nobody would be engaging in acts of atavistic barbarity.
This is an ahistorical fantasy. It is also a form of narcissism. In the perverse world-view of such people, nothing bad happens on the planet that is not centred on us in the West – from climate change to child labour to terrorism itself.
The big European powers and the US have, of course, misused and abused their clout at times (they have also helped create a world order that has brought peace and increasing prosperity to a growing number of regions). But the notion that they are the root of all evil in the world is as ludicrous as the notion that the non-Western world is or ever was an Eden before the wicked West slithered in.
The Middle East illustrates this better than anywhere else. Human civilisation first arose in the very lands where Isil is strongest. Ten-thousand years ago, farming and urbanisation began in the “hilly flanks” of southern Turkey and northern Syria/Iraq. Kingdoms and states in the region have been warring ever since, including over millennia when what is now called the West was stuck in the stone age and utterly uninvolved in the affairs of the region.
Bad things have always happened. Why they continue to happen in that region to the extent that they do, and why Islamist extremism has become more prevalent in recent decades, are complex questions with no one-factor answers. It is unlikely there ever will, or can be, agreement on the precise reasons
CANAMALAR
Last post on this. Yes,I get your point. First,arms dealers don’t NEED banks. Second,they won’t pay.
My XI:
DOUGLAS
CHA
TEBILY
SCHEIDT
ROGAN
BOERRIGTER
JACKSON
FLOOD
SYLLA
PUKKI
BIGGINS
BENCH- BANGURA, DU WEI, GORDON MARSHALL, BERKOVIC, CALDWELL, KILLEN
Barrack ..,
back to you
BMCUW…
Haha, no just in one of my daft moods, kids have already told me to p**s off, so I thought I would come on here:)))
Looking forward to Dublin and meeting your da from what i here…he has been secretly using that anti-ageing cream!
I reckon the both of us should give it a go before Dublin:))))))
A wee reply to Richard Gough:-
See, Richard, I am currently on trial for murdering your wife and family. However, imagine if you had murdered my wife and family. There is no way on earth that I would have wanted you to suffer the death penalty. Hell, I would not even have a desire to see you brought to trial. You murdered my family fairly and squarely in an imaginary universe- no way should you be punished for that.
But see if you had really murdered my wife, family or friends, in actual real life, you would not have the right to plead for mercy or make an imaginary plea that anybody else could have murdered and you would not feel any desire for vengeance. That would be just sick, would it not?
BENDIGO
Here’s a one-factor answer.
The Middle East was a hotbed of intellectualism.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_of_Alexandria
Now they read one book.
Was with three Huns at a dinner on Friday. I’d never met them before.
We started talking about football..I asked if they believed they were the same club and their take on their current troubles. I was gobsmacked.
They believed it’s everyone’s fault, PL The SFA and Green and Whyte HMRC the SMSM.
After explaining for about an hour..about DOS and the small tax case, the side letters, illegally registered players, EBTs, non disclosure of contracts, tax evasion and finally liquidation..and finally showing them the document from companies house that showed the club was liquidated. 2 agreed with me 1 left. They were ignorant of the facts and we’re gobsmacked about the revelations. At first they didn’t believe me and kept misquoting LNS as if they had been vindicated. Another 15 ensued explaining how that was incorrect and fatally flawed..so had them agreeing that a full enquiry was good for them to find out what went on and for all of Scottish football.
They seemed to be agreeing and when I approached the subject of title stripping for cheating…”they’re no taking our titles” so despite agreeing with all the points raised they don’t want punished..they were leaving at the end of the evening. “We are the peepul” they shouted as they left..cue plenty head shaking at the table.
If they are the educated Huns then we will get nowhere trying to deal with them. The pressure has to be applied to all clubs in Scotland and the SFA.
Punish the cheats..strip the league titles and cups.
Kikinthenakas
Any links to what Gough said?
Bobby..,
Me too, last one
Where do they keep their money, under their beds ?
It’s no a case of asking them
The discussion was hypothetical as far as I understood
How could we change it, that was my suggestion I am well aware of the issues putting such a plan into action but if enough govts made a concerted effort there is nothing the arms dealers or banks could do about it.
SIPSINI
I’m very proud of my Dad. Thon cream has nothing to do wi it.
And besides,he’s keeping it to himself!
Stairheedrammy on 15th November 2015 1:05 pm
Our top team based only on their highest level of performance whilst with us. Not on what they did elsewhere
Big Fraser
Danny McG, the one King Billy, Paul Elliot, big Tam G
Jinky, Bobby M, Wee Bertie
King Kenny
The King of kings, tongue tied Charlie Nic
Subs, the Buzz Bomb, The Maestro, Davie Hay.
============================
Exactly mine, apart from Boruc in nets, and I’d add Lubo to the bench just becasue he was feckin’ marvellous.
sipsini on 15th November 2015 2:01 pm
Any links to what Gough said?
=============================
In a nutshell – IF the king of kings , in some parallel universe, had had an ebt when he stopped their 10, then gough (Doo-Da-Doo-Da-Day…) would have accepted it with DIGNITY.
Because DIGNITY is what counts when you’ve been caught CHEATING, red-handed, for a decade…
kikinthenakas
You were luck then…….
If the third one hadn’t left they may have decided to “debate” using that curious mix of stupidity, bigotry and group bravado they turn to.
BMCUW
and a particular version of that book
Madonna stops her concert to give a very tearful, emotional, and heartfelt address to the crowd about the Paris attacks.
Then gets on with the gyrating and faux self-abuse…
Good call Sandman, I thought I’d go for a bit of midfield bite instead of overall flair
I am really surprised that Shunsuke Nakamura hasn’t even made the bench for at least one persons team, maybe Melbourne Mick should go with a best 11 of non scots to wear the hoops after he has dished out this tee shirt
Dickie Gough summarizes the Guilty mobs response to getting caught.
We might have done it but we didn’t cause any harm cos everyone else would have done it if they were us.
It’s part of that supremacist entitlement mindset that is almost impossible to change.
Does anyone remember Richard ( I prefer to call him Dick) Gough doing the 10 ( as in 10 in a row) hand sign after scoring against us in the year Wim stopped the 10?
He was an irrelevance then and he is an irrelevance now.
Pay no heed to the ranting of a mad man!
HH
Just back from worship.
Thoughts (as they do) wandered to current debate and Cof S “common sense” interpretation. This may have been posted on here before (several times) BUT
if they were loans ,as all and sundry on the dark side say, did any of the recipients ever attempt to pay them back? Ever, just one!!!!
HH