Following yesterday’s article on the cosy relationship between the police and Scottish Government, who are alarming a remarkably wide range of society, a flurry of information has been passed back to me, including the following notes on the Integration of Scottish Criminal Justice Information Systems (ISCJIS) database. The First Minister has stonewalled requests to breakdown religiously aggravated crime, claiming the Crown Office have destroyed their records, but my source suggests the information is available for analysis in the ISCJIS database. I’m told:
“The material stored (in the ISCJIS database) ranges from simple conviction records, to DNA, and social status. The data is used primarily for presenting Criminal History in court cases, and in identifying suspects in criminal investigations. It is also used of course to measure the social impact of changes in Legislation and Enforcement Policy, as evidenced by the current furore. It will also be used to predict the impact of such changes, particularly as regards Equality and Diversity impacts, which is a statutory requirement of any proposed Legislation. You see, the ‘missing’ data is actually necessary in predicting the impact on Equality of the Offensive Behaviour Bill.”
“Essentially, if you want to know how many Section 74 Breach of the Peace convictions (Aggravation for Religious Prejudice) or even charges, there were at a given point in time in a given court, you simply search on the Breach of the Peace Conviction Code and add the modifier code ‘P’ indicating Religious Aggravation. All such offences are then returned, with full access (rights permitted) to the Reports and Case Notes.”
To assist the First Minister, below is information on what the enquiry form he has to complete looks like. This is a link to the operation manual and if he’s really stuck he can call the helpdesk on 0141-585 – 8333.
We can only speculate why the authorities are so reluctant to disclose information on, on a subject so close to their hearts.
Quick shout for the John Thomson Memorial Fund, which is benefiting from the sale of 60″ posters for the recent stage play, check them out on ebay.
OFFENCE AGGRAVATION
DEFINITION: The code for a crime or offence that adds to the Offence Code by highlighting particular circumstances relating to the specific incident as opposed to the actual charge.
DATA ITEMS: Crime/Offence Aggravator.
PERMISSIBLE CHARACTER SET: Code field – Alpha or Zero.
RANGES/VALUES: The code field is 1 character long and consists of an alpha code, which identifies the Aggravation to the offence committed. It is possible that a charge can have a combination of up to 6 aggravations. An aggravation description may be held in a text field within individual systems and will be an automatic expansion of the Offence Aggravation code into text to specify the nature of the Aggravation.
PRIMARY OWNERSHIP: ISCJIS – maintained by Crown Office.
CODES: Over page:-
CODE Aggravation Inactive indicator
Anticipated activation date
0 No Aggravation
A Anti Social Behaviour
B Offending whilst on Bail
C Cancelled
D Domestic Abuse
E Disability
F Football
G Football Banning Order
H Harassment
I Harassment Order
J Connected to Serious Crime Y October 2010
K Offence against a child
OFFENCE MODIFIER DEFINITION: The code for a crime or offence which provides additional information for the specific incident as opposed to the actual charge.
PERMISSIBLE CHARACTER SET: Code field. Alpha, numeric.
RANGES/VALUES: The code field is 4 characters long and consists of an alphanumeric code, which identifies additional elements of the charge. The code will consist of an alphabetic character followed by 3 numeric characters. If no modifier exists, 4 0’s (zeroes) characters will be transferred. An Offence Modifier description may be held in a text field within individual systems and will be an automatic expansion of the Offence Modifier code into text to specify the nature of the Offence Modifier.
PRIMARY OWNERSHIP: ISCJIS maintained by Crown Office
CODES:- See offence modifier codes. The current
definitions are:-
A For Class A Drugs
B For Class B Drugs
C For Class C Drugs
W For Weapons
L Breach of undertaking
Y October 2010
N Sexual Orientation
O Sex Offenders Order
P Religious
R Racial
S Sexual
Q Transgender
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angelgabriel says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:20
as a matter of interest what is the tim friendly pub in Ayr?
no evidence that any agreement made regarding a newco
no evidence that the board will acquiesce
nothing
except for conspiracies, prejudice and ill-informed tittle-tattle.
stick to the facts people, stick to what we know, not what we think we know and make your judgements after the event.
good night all tims
Celtic Roller Coaster 23:13
Cracking story.
I have a beautiful niece who I think is the only girl at her school with Henrika for a middle name.
How my brother swung that I’ll never know.
We have a vast catalogue of great songs.
The huns have a double album of hate songs.
Its time for the support, lead by the GB, to really show how different we are to them. Lets hear our repertoire of Celtic hits on the 28th. The response will be offensive, racist, sectarian and illicit. Its all they know.
Hope you tune in Nevin.
Hh
Banner for the Green Brigade
Stop Sectarianism = Ban The Marches
Forget it- too offensive!!
auldheid…,
the sickest justification I have seen, your and all other gotcha premise is base on quid pro quo, quid pro quo is only valid if the the gravity of the offence is demonstrated or acceted, so far I have not seen it demonstrated, but I have seen it accepted.
There is no comparison, what you are saying is, the Celtic support are guilty of criminal behaviour by accepting th gotcha.
neveralone says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:26
Are you seriously saying that you are/were offended by the word TWAT…?
treatment for you I would think…..TWAT…
Moonbeams,
Right on Q….
———-
Celtic Football Club Statement
By: Newsroom Staff on 13 Dec, 2012 18:39
FOLLOWING UEFA´s decision yesterday (Monday) to impose a fine of 15,000 euros upon Celtic Football Club, the Club would like to clarify the reason for the fine being imposed.
The charge related to “illicit chanting”, specifically, “ooh ah up the Ra”, and fell under Article 11 – 2 e) of UEFA´s Disciplinary Regulations. These state:
“…….disciplinary measures may be taken against member associations or clubs in case of inappropriate behaviour on the part of their supporters including;
e) the use of gestures, words, objects or any other means to transmit any message that is not fit for a sports event, in particular if it is of a political, offensive or provocative nature ….”
Having reviewed the evidence provided by the police, we will not be appealing this decision.
This fine clearly demonstrates that UEFA takes such matters very seriously, and the Club would re-iterate its own position that such chanting is not welcome at Celtic Football Club.
It is extremely disappointing that the otherwise excellent behaviour of the vast majority of Celtic supporters, and the reputation of the Club, has been undermined by the actions of a tiny minority.
———
As I said in previous posts, The Green Brigade are leading the way in refining the songs….let them lead the entire stadium, because that’s what they do best just now.
For the record, I will be at Celtic Park next season. And the season after that. I support Celtic at Celtic Park. And at other football grounds. I may have views and songs to sing elsewhere that others may find offense with if they look hard enough, but I won’t be looking to prioritise those views r songs over Celtic or our reputation as a support.
The above is totally – TOTALLY – separate from the Bill that the SNP are driving though the Scottish Parliament just now. That is a different fight and a fight that needs to continue all the way to the ballot box. The SNP lose Holyrood tomorrow. They just don’t realise it yet.
Moonbeams WD
Sadly no I was on holiday.
My son & nephew were there and were not aware of any ‘illicit’ chants tho were at the ‘Celtic’ end. Equally I understand there were no newspaper reports of chanting until news of E Smiths intervention was published.
However there is no way Celtic would have accepted the rebuke without strong evidence in support. Why would they when there have been plenty of other known instances of some fans letting the Club down at other times & other places?
As stated to another poster earlier the ‘IRA’ ground is not one I would defend neither would the mass of Celtic supporters (IMO).
Choose our ground, make it impregnible
angelgabriel says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:20
Thanks for that. To be honest this is what I was expecting would happen but the only reason the pub in Ayr could show the game was because Celtic “sold” it to some overseas TV company. They also broadcast it via Celtic TV.
There has to be a long hard look at what the TV money at home games is bringing in and what is being lost on match day attendances and the “extras” that is earned from attendees.
If technology means a game being broadcast can be seen in easy travelling distance of CP then one answer for Celtic is NOT to broadcast it live to anyone.
The other option is to up the cost to subscribers but if they can watch for nowt in their local or via streams how effective would this be in recovering lost revenue?
I think an honest and open discussion is needed by all supporters and the club to come up with an income model that reflects the challenges of technology and that raises the awareness of how much the support depend on each other for the quality of team the club can afford to field.
In short,if Celtic are being watched live regularly, the person watching should be paying something towards the upkeep of the team. The means and how much have to be devised.
celtic40me
So the statement has been updated since earlier today. Did no one think of telling me.
Ya bundle of…
OK! That’s fine. No more worshipping the sun God.
Fine.
So are the club accepting this as read or have they been provided with the detail and video evidence. Surely if the evidence existed we’d have seen it on the BEEB.
I still believe our boards hands are all over this.
MWD
This aint illicit I hope!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7UHd7NVegE
mic1888
The Market Inn.
GOT
Sorry I thought YOU thought it derogatory!
Before I retire.
uefa’s regulation whatever it is, is just waiting for a bus to be driven through it.
For the club not to appeal this is tantamount to accepting the back of the bus for the rest of our lifes.
If singing/chanting about the IRA is deemed illicit/political/offensive, I would imagine it has to be the afore mentioned to everybody, and not just the sectarian people who run our country and our football association.
I am not offended by it, I doubt many outwith britland are offended by songs about a nations heritage, infact I would imagine most Irish people are not offended by songs that sing about their past.
With my limited knowledge of the law, trust me I could drive quite a few busswes through it, and even more busses through the proposed new scottish sectarian bill.
Back or front of the bus time people, your choice.
Lads i remember a lot of bhoys didn’t like john reid but when you hear king and a few huns in college say they hate him then you know he’s doing something right and i wish he was back in our corner right now.
Why don’t we all keep quiet at next home game in protest.
Moonbeams WD. \o/ Kano 1000 Supporting Neil Lennon 100%. says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:41
I still believe our boards hands are all over this.
Correct Mr Lawell is the prime suspect.
neveralone says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:42
GOT
Sorry I thought YOU thought it derogatory!
share
EH????
was watchin a Lubo video there
exhibit A
Klos’ face – “yev dun me”
haha
http://twitpic.com/7sy1az/full
mic1888 says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:39
==================
I like it
HH
mic
ludge 171
Is that the time?
Heading over to RTC blog now.
Good night CQNers
Let the people sing (What we’re allowed)
Hail Hail
Celtic Roller Coaster 23:13, I agree with tully57 its a cracking story to be proud of but I’d say you were blessed with an understanding wife who knows the love of Celtic……
Hail Hail to the CRC family!
V
antrimKev:
To me it means very little but this is a debate (amongst Celtic fans) of strategy.
We can accept that any mention of the ra in our songs is ‘illicit’ and help the establishment in their ‘whataboutery’ agenda by talking about stopping the “ra pish’.
Now don’t get me wrong, I’m very tempted.
I’m not the kind of fellow who wants to offend (even our orcish brethren).
I’m just not convinced that any such change is likely to be engendered by Celtic (apparently republican) fans calling republican songs “ra pish”
Equally, I cannot see any reason whatsoever that once ‘songs which mention the ra’ are accepted as being in some way illegitimate that this is where the matter will lie.
Your average orc bigot hates Celtic for its Irishness not its republicanism, for they see not a jot of difference betwixt the two.
I see nothing but an encouragement of their project in our doing anything other than defending the right of fans to sing political songs (even if we ourselves would prefer to focus on other subject matter).
I don’t want to be stubborn about this however; I’m happy to hear your rationale for your apparent optimism that not singing about the ra will satisfy, once and for all, the establishment and their orc friends. Why precisely are you so optimistic?
Moonbeams,
Having spent some time slaughtering the board for not telling us what the UEFA charge was, they go and tell us specifically what the charge was and then you turn to the “have they just accepted this as read or have they been provided with the detail and the video evidence?”
If you read the statement they say “Having reviewed the evidence provided by the police, we will not be appealing this decision.”
Do you think you may be looking for a reason to continue your assault on the board? Just a wee bit maybe?
Perhaps an open mind would help.
They have given the clarification you were wanting, the rest is up to you (us) now. Listen to the Green Brigade – they are on the right road I think. Refinement.
Nighty night CQN – travelling in the morning.
Hail Hail
Ceaser67 says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:49
?
MWD @ 22:47
Great post, difficult to agree with anything you say. This is not about singing up the ra, this is about so much more than that.
The club play songs written by the Wolfe Tones over the tannoy at Celtic Park, does this not endorse their songs and their sentiments ? Personally I am not in support of the line in question, however in the context of a crowd of 35k to 40k, should the club not be defending the innocent among the support of which there are many, as opposed to accepting the guilt of a small minority, but that would not suit their agenda.
I note that some posters have commented on the increase in the rebel songs at away matches, is it coincidence that this has happened as the away tickets are no longer sold by the club directly to season ticket holders, but by the away clubs due to yet another old firm business decision made by our board.
Let there be no doubt that this board will vote to keep the old firm intact in whatever format they can when Mr Whyte’s financial planning finally goes wrong.
neveralone
Off to bed …Take care and god bless..
Have the orange limps to arrange their own stewarding for their 500 limps next year? And pay for it?
Neil canamalar Lennon hunskelper extrordinaire says:
13 December, 2011 at 23:39
No quite the reverse.
By accepting the gotcha (and that gotchas happen) the Celtic support will avoid criminalisation in respect of the IRA addon just as Rangers supporters who accept the gotcha nature of TBB and TFS will avoid criminalisation.
The only constant in life is change and the only answer is adaptation.
A wee tune from UB40, get this song on the tannoy at CP……
We will sing our own songs!
V
chelsea listening to offers for torres? loan move?
come on, it’s almost january!
whereisowencoylesgranny? csc
Canamalar: 23:39:
Couldn’t agree more!
We are asked to choose appeasement when to do so is to legitimise our own criminalisation.
And we have Celtic fans rushing to condemn ‘ra pish’
sigh…
“This fine clearly demonstrates that UEFA takes such matters very seriously, and the Club would re-iterate its own position that such chanting is not welcome at Celtic Football Club.”
The Celtic soul is dead, long live the Celtc soul. RIP more than a club.
The result the masonic bastards have been backing their own support into for the last 4 years.
You are not an individual you are property.
mic
Won 7-1 lol
and here’s me and the man himself in 2002 before the Zidane Cup Final at Hampden
what a guy !
http://twitpic.com/7sy6d9/full
MWD,
I appreciate the Celtic Board have been put in a difficult position if they have nothing to hide. I always took satisfaction from the fact Celtic were always transparent about their accounts, never really paid attention to these things prior to joining this site.
I would like the Celtic Board to put into the public domain the evidence that has Damned the whole Celtic Support, especially given the whole circumstances around it.
We have a game to win on Thursday and we should concentrate on it fully for the moment.
Neil Lennon is fighting for us like noone else ever has and he deserves every last ounce of our support for him, his backroom staff and his players.