Just days after The Beating of Barca in 2004 the youthful Celtic chief executive, Peter Lawwell presented teenage sensation, David Marshall, with a new contract, reward for his incredible goalkeeping performances against the Catalans. Having made only a single first team appearance, in a cup game against (then) lower league opponents, David played the second half of the first leg against Ronaldinho & Co, then all of the second leg, without conceding a goal.
It Camp Nou performance was the most remarkable I’ve seen from a keeper. After years looking for a solid performer to make the position his own, it looked like we had a new star.
A year later David had, if anything, regressed. He remained first choice until after the start of season 2005-06 but Artur Boruc, for a while the genuine article, soon replaced him. David was shipped out to Norwich before eventually settling at Cardiff City, where he has built a solid career, but his star never shone as brightly as we expected it to. His Scottish contemporaries, Allan McGregor and Craig Gordon, both overtook him.
It is incredibly hard for a youth player to break into a team like Celtic in a position like goalkeeper, or striker, the pressure to deliver – every time – is so high, we are a whole lot more likely to introduce wingers. The parallels between David Marshall and Tony Watt are remarkable, so far.
From the outside it’s hard to guess what went wrong for David at Celtic. He lost his place at Celtic when he was just 20 and the trajectory of his career was never the same but 20 is still remarkably young for a keeper working at Champions League level. Tony Watt is two years younger than David and he is in the considerably better position of being able to come on as substitute for sections of games, or to drop away for a few weeks, if necessary.
We should expect more fantastic splurges of form from the player but there will be frustrations and dips in form too. He has the skill, speed and strength to make it. With hard work and patience he stands an excellent chance.
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Summa,
maybe… but if the claims of harassment and victimisation are true – and I’ve no reason to doubt them – I understand them assessing their options for protest, and coming to this conclusion. Its far from ideal, but what other options are available.
SFTB has a point though, in that it would be more effective to consult with the wider support and agree a co-ordinated approach, rather than just leaving 111 empty. This would solidify the support and prevent a divide-and-conquer strategy being deployed between the GB and rest of the support.
CP without the GB will be as flat as a pancake for two games.
The Board will realise what effect their absence next year will have on season book sales.
I think that’s the point of the action.
IMO the board are basking in the glow from the huge financial input or CL adventure is providing.
They need to earn their money now by supporting supporters.
If they are being forced to comply with police harrassment then they should say.
Unless they are all highly remunerated wimps.
or=our
Valentine’s Day
23:39 on
16 November, 2012
Magnificentseven
AYE
in what way is that relevant to the discussion?
My hopes for tommorow
a comfortable injury free victory over the dons
a roaring success for the wee Oscar race night
and if I can be greedy a winner in the tipster competition :)))
Good night all may all your days be Blessed
A special thought to Vmhan and his family on their loss
Ernie Lynch
No, not anti-Semitic. Ani-Zionist for sure sure. He forgot to say couple of things in his article.
The Zionism was big political issue there. Many Jews were pro new Israel, many were against. His vews do not surprise me but his selective memory does.
Vinny is in the Green Brigade.
he took me there at the new year huns game, a great night out in my celtic life and he went out of his way to make it happen for me. We met briefly in the great lost the huddle hound event when the Kano foundation was in town, and then recently at the Oscar bucket collection, when the funny stories and smart chat was just wonderful.
also with Ton Che Dan.
I havnt been on properly for a few weeks with work getting in the road,
but , this is what our people, real people are about.
god bless mr martin.
—————————————————————-
Vmhan
10:42 on
16 November, 2012
Morning Celts,
I have the hang over from hell, Celtic brand whisky and a few bottles of cava…..
My dad, Jack Martin passd away yesterday and thankfully (for me) I was with him over the last ….. hard days, more importantly I was with my mum and spent some quality time with her.
The CQN’ers on here have been very good with the kind thoughts and words when I went up to Scotland on Sunday, and although I’ve flounced out of FB etc, my friends got the news and sent me kind messages of help and support (you bhoys know who you are, thanks again).
My dad, well not a lot of people know that he was borne in Ireland, Derry City to be exact although he was only a young schoolboy, when he left to live in Scotland.
I was surprised, but I should’nt have been, to hear that my dad wants his ashes spread over the river Foyle in Derry, this in my opinion is the greatest way to go and I’d be up for the same myself…… well done Jack Martin
I know it’s often mentioned on here of the greatest games we all went to. I was very close to tears at missing the Barca game at CP, for me, it had to be done but my big regret was that father never got to see that game, he took me to so many great games and probably shouldn’t because of school next day, but even then he knew my passion was strong and on reflection ….. thanks dad, you done the right thing.
The best games my father took me too? was it the European Cup semi at Hampden park with 136, odd thousand fans, was it the last time the Lisbon Lions played together when we skelped Clyde 9-0 (I think), the 10 men won the league sticks in my mind as my father was driving the bus that day and every single window was broken as the Zombies (old liquidated Zombies) yet again rioted, while the police force of that time stood idly by, I was there and I watched that, in fact not much difference to how we are treated in the GB with their video cameras and the searches, you Bhoys don’t know the half of that.
I’ve ran out of steam/ words and just wanted to thank you all for the kind words from last weekend and the recent texts.
Sometimes words are not enough but this morning I have some and wanted to share with this Celtic community.
My dad will be in St Joseph’s in Greenock on Tuesday night and the Funeral ,is the next morning all are welcome and back to the Greenock CSC for those who want to chat and remember, all welcome.
Vinny
Just been watching champion boxer Ricky Burns fight Kevin Bridges on Youtube.
I thought Ricky had a familiar winningness about him, turns out he is from Coatbridge, the town that spawned the liked of Tony Watt, Bob Crampsey, David Hannah, Chris Iwelumo, Mark Millar, and played host to Jock Stein during his Albion Rovers days.
Is it any wonder that Coatbridge is called the Athens of North Lanarkshire? (thumbsup)
leftclicktic
23:45 on
16 November, 2012
I’ve obviously missed earlier news… what loss to Vmhan and his family?
” so a simple 2 game ban is an overreaction…..”
Nope.
” . a letter to the Times will sort it”
I wouldnt think so. I’d try Celtic park first.
Maybe it has been tried. I only asked if such a route had been taken.
JimmyQuinnsBits
23:47 on
16 November, 2012
leftclicktic
23:45 on
16 November, 2012
I’ve obviously missed earlier news… what loss to Vmhan and his family?
his dad mate RIP
Saint Stivs, Leftclicktic,
wasn’t aware
Vmhan… so sorry
words are useless
Good night to one and all and though I have never had any banter with Vmhan I have travelled with the Greenock buses in the 1970s and hope he will accept my condolences.
I take the John Donne view of death: “any man’s death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.”
Eternal rest grant unto him etc.
Philbhoy
But they won’t say if they are in cahoots with the polis,they are petrified of the msm, they want to be seen as whiter than white, and will do what they are told or asked.
Big nan -I apologise for my over-reaction. You summarise my opinion correctly and I respect your view.
philbhoy
“A complete bhoycott of those two games leaves the board in no doubt”
Does it take a two game boycott to remove doubt?
Would they think a one game boycott was just showboating?
What if they were counting on 3 games being missed as their cue to panic?
I cannot see anything but an arbitrary reaction here and a unitary one. Why do the GB not seek common ground as a starting point and not an afterthought?
BTW all the jibes from other posters about writing letters or doing nothing are pretty immature.
The harassment deserves a strong response. I am arguing that my proposal would make more, not less, impact than the GBs chosen course.
Kilbowie Kelt & Setting Free The Bears.
I agree with both your comments.
Don’t jump head first into Boycotts ,Who are you going to harm,it won’t be the police,I think they would be happy with a bit of strife among the Support,you would be doing their job for them,you must talk to the rest of the support for us to be united,to declare a unilateral boycott by the green brigade alone will accomplish nothing,our club could withstand that for a few weeks.
Do you think that the police would ask Celtic for addresses and telephone numbers,I doubt it, that would implicate the police in all of this.
How did the papers like the News of the World manage to get any amount of telephone numbers,they done it illegally.
All this strife started when the SNP led Scottish Parliament decided to change the laws governing the land,I think the blame lands on their doorstep,get the law changed back,or we will boycott voting for that party.
philvis
Athens or Ass End?
Zbyszek
23:45 on 16 November, 2012
‘No, not anti-Semitic. Ani-Zionist for sure sure. He forgot to say couple of things in his article.
The Zionism was big political issue there. Many Jews were pro new Israel, many were against.’
No shit, Sherlock.
Magnificentseven
23:45 on
16 November, 2012
Valentine’s Day
23:39 on
16 November, 2012
Magnificentseven
AYE
in what way is that relevant to the discussion?
what discussion?
Vmhan
Sincere condolences on your loss.
Inspiring words, and a fitting epitaph for your Father.
Saint Stivs, thanks for reporting that, been busy at work and missed it.
Big Nan –
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsYY2U2altk&feature=related (thumbsup)
As the man who observed boycott at Legia Warsaw stadium three years back and who observe similar boycott now, I can say this is wrong decision.
Gordon64
if you are referring to my post – consider this.
My 18 year old son was in 111 for the last 2 years. he didn’t renew this season and that is SOLELY due to the treatment he has received on a weekly basis. photographed, searched and harrassed at EVERY game.
He’s at Uni studying Business – not a ned. He decided he didn’t want the aggro. Young Celtic fans are being DEMONISED for supporting their team.
My dad took me to the games when I was young. i’ve taken my son and at 18 he’s walking away!
Guys like you are the problem. Climb out of your bubble, mate.
This is the reality. It’s not an over -reaction.
“Football without fans is nothing – Jock Stein”.
Doc
You still needing that lift?
Is there,honestly,anyone on this site seriously believe that the Celtic hierarchy does not know what is happening with the Green Brigade
IMHO the Directors of our club are in cahoots with the police in this matter.If not come out and tell us,then I will opologise for my assumptions.
Ernie Lynch at 23:55
What ?
Celtic Park with no GB next season.
What will that do to ticket sales?
How will the board react to that prospect?
setting free the bears – Athens, my friend.
It has long been fashionable within Scotland to sneer at Coatbridge, due to its largely Irish-descended working class population. I’ve even known priests who made this mistake. But Coatbridge, to those of us who know her, is a place of joy and hope.
From the Victorian grandeur of the Carnegie Library and the sandstone magnificence of Blairhill, to the ornate beauty of St. Patrick’s or St. Augustine’s, to the pastoral idyll of Greenhill, Coatbridge has it all. (thumbsup)
Zbyszek.
Ignore him.
The questions that needs to be answered are
Why are the Green Brigade being targeted ?
and
Is their evidence our board are involved.
If so why ?
Given everthing the GB brings to Celtic i find
it hard to believe our board are complicit
in this persecution.
Then again nothing would surprise me.
hamiltontim
Aye, if you can, don’t worry if its a hassle, I can get the train up.
Valentine’s Day
23:55 on
16 November, 2012
Magnificentseven
23:45 on
16 November, 2012
Valentine’s Day
23:39 on
16 November, 2012
Magnificentseven
AYE
in what way is that relevant to the discussion?
what discussion?
not another one who can’t keep up with what they post…friday night juice :-)
you raised it, now you don’t know what point you were making….. have a good night…maybe too late with that one though!
Zbyszek
00:01 on 17 November, 2012
Ernie Lynch at 23:55
‘What ?’
It’s a colloquialism. It means you’ve stated something that’s obvious and not in dispute.
this is over-due reaction from the GB and not an over-reaction – anyone who thinks otherwise has their heads buried in their prawn sandwiches (and gimme peace and dont bother slagging off the site that this is held on)
from http://internationalsocialist.org.uk/index.php/2012/10/green-brigade-speak-out-against-police-harassment/
STATEMENT
Last year was somewhat unique. It will rightly be remembered as the year our great rivals died. Yet what seemed to almost slip under the radar amidst the hilarity at Ibrox was the continued harassment of the Green Brigade, and the Celtic fans in general by Strathclyde Police both before and after the SNP legislation was scribbled. We have remained relatively quiet on this issue up until now, but it has got us nowhere and the harassment has continued; in fact it has worsened.
Most Celtic fans heard about the unprecedented case of the 17 year old Celtic fan remanded in custody at HM Polmont Young Offenders Institution for an alleged breach of the peace. The fall-out and the protests of other Celtic fans led to that thankfully being overturned before too much damage was done to a young boy. However, there are numerous other cases that haven’t been made public and so the Police have escaped criticism and been allowed to arrest and charge who they want, when they want. These include three of our members arrested by CID (two at home, one at work) after holding a banner reading ‘Huns FC’. Their case lasted the best part of two years before finally a ‘Not proven’ verdict was delivered. The cost of that case will have been astronomical. Clearly unhappy at this, the Police arrested one of the above AGAIN, this time for alleged sectarian singing. This never even made the courtroom, after the CCTV was shown outside the court, showing him clearly singing ‘Up the Celts’ much to the embarrassment of the officers who turned up as Prosecution witnesses.
After the highly-successful ‘Fans Against Criminalisation’ demo at George Square, Celtic played Hibs in a bore 0-0 draw. The game will be remembered by many though, after the Police unnecessarily waded into 111 looking to make arrests for reasons unknown. On the concourse after the game, they successfully arrested one of our members, accusing him of abusing their officers. Again, this was nothing but a blatant lie and led to another court case with THREE different trial dates. A Not Guilty verdict was returned when the case was finally heard.
A month or so later, and we had another member in court. This time his alleged crime was for ‘assault and resisting arrest’ at a Semi-final at Hampden. Again though, he was found not guilty. We have some other court cases pending as we speak, but we are confident these will go the same way as every other one so far. However, they are still obviously causing massive inconvenience and are having a huge effect on people’s livelihoods.
These charges have all led to our members missing matches watching and supporting the team they love. Celtic had banned every one of them while the cases were on-going. Indeed, the club do all they can to facilitate the Police and have offered no help whatsoever to their own support. After the match in Udine in December, Celtic banned a handful of supporters after flares were lit before kick off. One of these fans was a female season book holder in 111 whom, rather bizarrely, was watching the match from the comfort of her own living room! Thankfully, this was overturned eventually after it was pointed out to Celtic security that they had quite clearly made a rather embarrassing yet damaging mistake.
The level of surveillance applied to section 111 and the Green Brigade specifically verges on the surreal and is an astronomical waste of tax payers’ money. 90 minute surveillance clearly isn’t sufficient though as we learn from being filmed when approaching and leaving stadiums. A small band of Strathclyde Police following our members around Europe attempting to make their trips abroad uncomfortable also now appears to be common practice. Perhaps the hardest one for us to take is being filmed when inside Celtic Park hours early setting up for a display. Further from Celtic officials obviously accommodating such procedures they now believe it to be acceptable to hand over personal details of our members. Private information such as mobile phone numbers, names and addresses have been swapping hands without consent, even in instances where there is no alleged crime to answer for. Sadly, for us at least, this type of behaviour isn’t wholly surprising from Celtic officials – whether it is being sanctioned by Chief Executive Peter Lawwell who privately described our songs as ‘cancerous’ or Head of Security Ronnie Hawthorn who willingly will ban dedicated Celtic supporters offering them no chance of a defence against their alleged breach.
In recent weeks there has been a noticeable upsurge from Strathclyde Police in targeting the Celtic support. Up until now they have tried and failed to secure convictions for singing Irish Republican songs, attempting to concoct all manner of charges desperate to find one that will stick. Under their new ‘Anti-Football Legislation’ they are now targeting the Roll of Honour with a number of fans being arrested and charged with ‘offensive behaviour’ and even ‘Racial BOTP’ for singing this song. The most recent arrest being one of our members who was arrested while leaving Celtic Park at the Kilmarnock fixture and who has only just been released after being handed a weekend in the cells.
Co-coincidentally, or ironically even, the accused just happens to be someone who has already been through the charade of a football charge with all the accompanying delights and he came away victorious. You’d excuse his paranoia for thinking he was being targeted and tested here.
Perhaps quite unbelievable to some it is not just at or around matches where we get such unwarranted attention. A few months ago one of our members applied for a licence to become a taxi driver. Normally, this would be a straight-forward procedure for a young man with nothing but a minor Breach of the Peace charge from his teenage years. Not quite. He received a letter explaining that his application had been rejected on the grounds that he’s not a ‘fit and proper person’ – an accusation based solely on his connections to the Green Brigade. This had come from the Chief Constable. Thankfully, after appeal, the licence was granted in the end but with no thanks to Strathclyde Police.
The above is just some of the instances of police harassment in the last 10-12 months. Not only is it causing innocent football fans great stress and hitting them badly in the pocket, it’s also costing the taxpayer a fortune. For too long, we have sat back and let them do as they please but it has to stop, and we hope that the coming weeks and months will eventually see a change in their approach and we can get back to supporting our team without fear of arrest at home or away. We believe we sacrifice an awful lot as individuals and as a group in what we do. We dedicate our time and money for our passion of supporting Celtic in our style and we have always attempted to maintain an amicable working relationship with Celtic employees for the benefit of both parties – even when in dispute over certain issues. However we will not tolerate the level of harassment we continue to face nor Celtic PLC’s compliant attitude.
Over on the other side of the river, we have a looper who at least is standing up for his support and club.
Not that I am saying I want our board to act the same, but somewhere in the middle would be acceptable, instead of the complete percieved lack of support from our suits.
But they way it’s looking, It seems to me that the suits want the GB gone, they don’t want the grief from the polis and the politicos and the msm.
I think they are under the impression that if the team do well on the park, the support will turn out come what may, they may well be right, but it’s a hell of a gamble to take imo.
You know Ernie, you can discuss like that with your friends, maybe with your family.
Oldtim67
Thanks. I will from now.